CURT NICKISCH: You’ve written two books about joy, first “Joy, Inc.” and now “Chief Joy Officer,” but I want to take you back maybe to a non-joyful place and I want to ask about maybe the worst job you had or maybe the worst day at that job that you had? CURT NICKISCH: I think the question a lot of listeners are going to have now is, so how do you try to do that at as a CEO and as a leader in your company and stay away from that urge to, you know, have fear be the driver and and let something else drive people, which is maybe a little more complicated and a little harder to measure and maybe know right away if it’s working?