And, and one of the things that Beth and I have seen in our research as well as when we’ve done consulting and just talking to people, is that many leadership initiatives or culture change initiatives, DEI initiatives, many of those initiatives may fail. TINA OPIE: Well, it could be from the bottom up in the sense that the input… So one of the things that I like to talk about is how sometimes these initiatives, you say, “We’re gonna really help, um, women employees,” but the leadership may have never checked in with the women throughout the organization.