Kagan: I went through the process of thinking about my support for the Iraq war long before this Iran issue came up. My position is that the United States has other tools rather than the almost exclusive application of hard power and coercion. One is obviously the role of Jews in influencing American policy, which is a reality just the way the Irish, Italians, or Greeks have influenced American policy. Kagan: I myself almost never talk about a rules-based order because the United States has definitely pursued a double standard with regard to the rules-based order. Knowing that the United States does bad things does not answer the question of should the United States be involved in the world.