It was a complete mess, as all the uncomfortable details were revealed, Fauci was questioned intensely, and he pleaded the Fifth 111 times. The baseline defense of this is that he’s trying to avoid perjury traps, which, in this hearing, wouldn’t be covered under Biden’s blanket pardon. CNN's Erin Burnett asks an NYU law professor if Fauci is in real trouble after pleading the Fifth 111 times. Because he says, well, 'I had to do that because, you know, they're looking for perjury traps,' or does that just make it worse and is he in real trouble?" BURNETT: "And also when the reason [to plead the Fifth] is perjury traps... to the layperson, it's saying, well, 'Why wouldn't you just say the truth?